OMFG. I actually crafted a real post trying to bring people together on this ... but eff it! We're done hurling insults at each other.

I'm locking this thread. Awe can do what he likes with this vote. But if this thread is reopened or if any other thread thakes this turn, I'll shut it down as well. It's done.

I am not really comfortable with the administrative team using their own judgment on shutting down freedom of speech. I am not sure that this is in the best interest of the South Pacific, or in our healing journey.

I really urge the administrative team to refrain from locking threads / threatening that any discussion of certain topics will be suppressed.

Formerly Relevant, Currently Former.

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I fully disagree with you on this HEM.
I would have locked the thread myself, had Tsu not done it first.
That discussion was way off topic. And on at least 2 occasions it was brought up to get back on topic.
It became an argument thread with personal insults starting to fly around.

If it was a useful discussion related to the topic is was there for, it could have stayed open.

Semi-Unretired

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I imagine that Awe can reopen it if he likes.

[Image: HuoZhaoDao.png]

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OMFG. I actually crafted a real post trying to bring people together on this ... but eff it! We're done hurling insults at each other.

I'm locking this thread. Awe can do what he likes with this vote. But if this thread is reopened or if any other thread thakes this turn, I'll shut it down as well. It's done.

I am not really comfortable with the administrative team using their own judgment on shutting down freedom of speech. I am not sure that this is in the best interest of the South Pacific, or in our healing journey.

I really urge the administrative team to refrain from locking threads / threatening that any discussion of certain topics will be suppressed.

I'm going to be really honest HEM. And, I don't care.

I rarely take this stance, but I'm #overit at this point.

If it makes you feel any better, I did it within my role as delegate and one of the only people trying to keep this effing region together, not as my role as an admin. All delgates have supermod abilities.

In the future, I'll ask that you take your constructive criticism and apply it to the discussion and "ideas" you're so valiantly defending. Because that thread was off topic and a toxic waste dump where people were simply airing dirty laundry. It had long passed the point of productive discussion so let's not pretend I was shutting something down because I didn't like it.

-tsunamy
[forum admin]

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I fully disagree with you on this HEM.
I would have locked the thread myself, had Tsu not done it first.
That discussion was way off topic. And on at least 2 occasions it was brought up to get back on topic.
It became an argument thread with personal insults starting to fly around.

If it was a useful discussion related to the topic is was there for, it could have stayed open.

And so un-elected, virtually unaccountable officers get to decide what is protected as free speech and what is not? That is a part of the problem we are having with the administrative team: they take on extra-legal actions that is not their job. If Awe closed the thread, that is their authority as Chair of the Assembly. Awe is accountable to citizens, and citizens have a process upon which they can appeal that action. 

I am NOT arguing the topic was productive. I am arguing that it should not have been closed, and an administrator should NOT have threatened to close any topics that dare to breech similar topics.

Think of it as a, "I don't like what you had to say, but I defend your right to say it," sort of thing.

I imagine that Awe can reopen it if he likes.

Not according to Tsunamy..

Formerly Relevant, Currently Former.

Reply

I fully disagree with you on this HEM.
I would have locked the thread myself, had Tsu not done it first.
That discussion was way off topic. And on at least 2 occasions it was brought up to get back on topic.
It became an argument thread with personal insults starting to fly around.

If it was a useful discussion related to the topic is was there for, it could have stayed open.

And so un-elected, virtually unaccountable officers get to decide what is protected as free speech and what is not? That is a part of the problem we are having with the administrative team: they take on extra-legal actions that is not their job. If Awe closed the thread, that is their authority as Chair of the Assembly. Awe is accountable to citizens, and citizens have a process upon which they can appeal that action. 

I am NOT arguing the topic was productive. I am arguing that it should not have been closed, and an administrator should NOT have threatened to close any topics that dare to breech similar topics.

Think of it as a, "I don't like what you had to say, but I defend your right to say it," sort of thing.

I imagine that Awe can reopen it if he likes.

Not according to Tsunamy..

I've clarified my stance HEM. I can't remember a time when I've closed a thread like this as an admin. I wouldn't have intervened here, either.

I did this as my role as delegate and we have processes for a recall if this is that much of a problem.

-tsunamy
[forum admin]

Reply

OMFG. I actually crafted a real post trying to bring people together on this ... but eff it! We're done hurling insults at each other.

I'm locking this thread. Awe can do what he likes with this vote. But if this thread is reopened or if any other thread thakes this turn, I'll shut it down as well. It's done.

I am not really comfortable with the administrative team using their own judgment on shutting down freedom of speech. I am not sure that this is in the best interest of the South Pacific, or in our healing journey.

I really urge the administrative team to refrain from locking threads / threatening that any discussion of certain topics will be suppressed.

I'm going to be really honest HEM. And, I don't care.

I rarely take this stance, but I'm #overit at this point.

If it makes you feel any better, I did it within my role as delegate and one of the only people trying to keep this effing region together, not as my role as an admin. All delgates have supermod abilities.

In the future, I'll ask that you take your constructive criticism and apply it to the discussion and "ideas" you're so valiantly defending. Because that thread was off topic and a toxic waste dump where people were simply airing dirty laundry. It had long passed the point of productive discussion so let's not pretend I was shutting something down because I didn't like it.

I didn't say you closed it because you didn't like it. I said it was not your place to close it, and that is my opinion. I then came to the Operations Center to lodge my opinion in a professional and respectful manner. I did not accuse you of being corrupt, or evil, or not having our best interests at heart — I gave my opinion. I am told we live in a region where that is allowed.

And furthermore, the implication that my opinion is somehow irreconcilable with my "ideas" is rather upsetting. 

This response is disappointing, and to be completely honest Tsu, a little beneath you.

Formerly Relevant, Currently Former.

(This post was last modified: 03-01-2016, 05:35 PM by HEM.)

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Just to keep everyone on track, are we discussing Sam's CSS Membership Recall or the dictionary definition of a Coup?

Com'on guys -- this is getting really far off topic and veering into personal territory.

Since it is apparent that decorum has been thrown out the window, and that this thread has devolved into something else. I kindly ask  the Chairman of the Assembly to temporarily lock this thread to allow individuals to cool their heads before addressing the issue at hand, Sam111 removal from the CSS.

Given that this thread has largely derailed at this point, I seek the consensus of Assembly members to put the proposed recall motion to vote.

I think that we have fallen far off the topic. The topic at hand was to recall Sam111 from the CSS, not to debate regarding a coup or how someone words things. Can we get back to the main topic, or is that so hard to ask? I do not mean to sound rude in the least by saying this. What I mean is that we need to debate on the issue at hand, and leave all issues that don't regard this for another time or in personal messages.

Just for the record, please see the above posts and note that they all suggested the thread was off topic.
Some even suggested the thread be locked due to it. 5 pages before it was locked.
It's fair to say that this thread would have been locked by someone, be it Tsu, myself, or even the chair. It was going to be locked.

It just so happens that Tsu did it. He is an admin, but he is also a cabinet member accountable to the people just like the chair.

Semi-Unretired

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Thank you for those examples Drugged Monkeys. Again, I don't think the discussion was productive. But I have been opposed to locking threads — particularly by administrators, or those who are not the Assembly Chair — for over a half decade in this region.

I've stated my opinion, and despite implications to the contrary, that's all I set out to do.

Formerly Relevant, Currently Former.

(This post was last modified: 03-01-2016, 05:45 PM by HEM.)

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I didn't say you closed it because you didn't like it. I said it was not your place to close it, and that is my opinion. I then came to the Operations Center to lodge my opinion in a professional and respectful manner. I did not accuse you of being corrupt, or evil, or not having our best interests at heart — I gave my opinion. I am told we live in a region where that is allowed.

And furthermore, the implication that my opinion is somehow irreconcilable with my "ideas" is rather upsetting. 

This response is disappointing, and to be completely honest Tsu, a little beneath you.

Let's be clear -- I fielded calls to close that thread for two days before I actually did. I tried to bring it back on topic and was in the process of trying to pull everyone together.

This is this my most graceful moment? No. I'm aware of that.

Did I just snap at you? Absolutely. So my legitimately sorry if I'm reacting out of anger.

Frankly, I'm frustrated and out of ideas. I've been mediating fights literally all day today and it's starting to get the better of me.

We both know that I only intervene when all else fails and -- I agree with you -- that I hope that remains an admin policy. But, I'm not going to lie that when I've given my all and still get criticized, I take it personally. So once again, I apologize if I've been harsh.

-tsunamy
[forum admin]

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