Balder informed us that the proscription has been repealed.

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I seem to have forgotten, but what does their proscription cover? Is it just a regional one, or are there any individual proscriptions included with that?

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Yes yes yes.

Having bad relationships diplomatically is... bad. So yes we shouldn

Local Councilroar.

Selfie

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My apologies for being late to the game.
Here are my thoughts:

Wouldn't a detente with Balder potentially threaten our already ice-y relations with Osiris? I know we both have a common rival - TBH - so establishing relations with them with this reason in mind would be somewhat easier than nothing; however, considering Balder's notable history of choosing their frivals (friends + rivals) wisely, I must make a point that this could threaten our eyes in the raider-sphere.

Additionally, I must make another point: how long will the bald head of Balder cast it's aggressive, reflective light on the eyes of Osiris? How long will this skirmish last? Will it eventually return to the status quo? If this was indeed a temporary change in perception, then this detente will collapse as soon as it started; however, I do have hopes for it. If this is successful, then that means we could have ties to the fragmented imperialist-sphere of which we could help foster to battle our combatants in the raider-sphere. But I get ahead of myself sometimes...

Local Councillor (3/15/20 - 6/23/20)
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Ambassador to Osiris and TWP (4/3/20 - 7/8/20)
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Balder and Osiris relations have been tenuous for years. At least around the time after Raven was delegate. It is unlikely that that will be put aside. IMO, Balder (and those associated with Balder) tries to play the political game (despite lack of activity). This sort of political game is reminiscent of years past. Their brand has always been on the Raiding spectrum of gameplay and control/influence/imperialism. You see what you get though, at least in the lens of IC political gameplay.

Osiris on the other hand, is not like this at all. It would reflect more on the meta of current gameplay politics. That being no real politics existing and being instead socialization and drama.

I'd trust the side that aims to just play a political game, even if they do things our royal we do not agree with.

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My apologies for being late to the game.
Here are my thoughts:

Wouldn't a detente with Balder potentially threaten our already ice-y relations with Osiris? I know we both have a common rival - TBH - so establishing relations with them with this reason in mind would be somewhat easier than nothing; however, considering Balder's notable history of choosing their frivals (friends + rivals) wisely, I must make a point that this could threaten our eyes in the raider-sphere.

Additionally, I must make another point: how long will the bald head of Balder cast it's aggressive, reflective light on the eyes of Osiris? How long will this skirmish last? Will it eventually return to the status quo? If this was indeed a temporary change in perception, then this detente will collapse as soon as it started; however, I do have hopes for it. If this is successful, then that means we could have ties to the fragmented imperialist-sphere of which we could help foster to battle our combatants in the raider-sphere. But I get ahead of myself sometimes...

The way we handle our relationships with Balder and Osiris shouldn't be much different from how we approach our relationships with TEP and TWP. We shouldn't be too cautious to worry so deeply about what Osiris will think about this move. If that was the case, we would have had to worry about what the WALL regions had to think about us forming the PfS.

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(This post was last modified: 03-26-2021, 12:48 AM by Jay Coop.)

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The way we handle our relationships with Balder and Osiris shouldn't be much different from how we approach our relationships with TEP and TWP.

I very much disagree with this. Let's say, hypothetically, that we established relations with NPO and TNP before we established relations with TEP and TWP. In this hypothetical scenario, establishing relations with TEP and TWP would be easier since we would have already gained a rough estimate - not a say perfect estimate - of how unaligned and Independent regions work in terms of foreign policy. In the situation that we are in now, we haven't established any relations with a region that operates on an R/D level such as Osiris and Balder; meaning, we have no precedents to call upon. As such, it would be very unwise to treat regions such as Osiris and Balder, which are very different in comparison to TEP and TWP in terms of R/D, in the same way that we treated relations with TEP and TWP.  

Moreso, your statement groups both Balder and Osiris in the handling of their relations, implying that the way we would handle relations between them would be the same - you used the word "and". If the overall description of Osiris' FA policy told by Legs in this thread is correct, which is that they don't really have one and it's all based on PR, appearance, and socialization, then that means in order for us to increase relations with them we would just have do "*buddy" events with them and our mutual Independent "buddies" (e.g an Osiris, TNP, and TSP "buddy" event). If the overall description of Balder's FA policy told by Legs in this thread is correct, which is that they are heavily calculative in choosing their allies, neutrals, and rivals, then we would have to do considerably more work in forming even a single relation with them compared to Osiris. Thus, the handling of their relations would have to be different and not the same. 

*I know the term "buddy" is not a very diplomatic term, but I couldn't think of another one. 
 

We shouldn't be too cautious to worry so deeply about what Osiris will think about this move. If that was the case, we would have had to worry about what the WALL regions had to think about us forming the PfS.

That is true; however, the formation of something of the likes of PfS was inevitable. If there was an Independent-Raider League centered around controlling the WA, then there would have to be a Defender-everyone who won't follow WALL League of some sort to counteract its influence. If WALL actually expected that they would hold an eternal, majority vote in the WA, then they are far less smart than they seem.

Meanwhile, before the establishment of meager relations with them, the possibility of a formation of relations between TSP and Osiris was an utter coin toss. TSP and Osiris came from two opposing R/D ideologies, two opposing forms of governing, and two opposing forms of FA-policy. As such, the likelihood of the formation of relations between the two was very unlikely; yet, somehow, they happened.

With that in mind, I think that we should be cautious about how we proceed with Balder. I'm not saying that we should send a formal letter to Osiris' government asking how they would feel about us establishing relations with Balder, but I think that we should keep our interests with them in mind.

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MoE Leadership (10/14/20 - 11/1/21)

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I seem to have forgotten, but what does their proscription cover? Is it just a regional one, or are there any individual proscriptions included with that?

From what I've found from digging around in the Osiris forum, it seems to target Glen specifically (here's the link to the proposal and the voting thread);

Glen-Rhodes - A security official, and the Chair of the Assembly in The South Pacific - is actively advocating a coup against Osiris. This is not the first time he and other TSP officials have engaged in hostile rhetoric, and a region that repeatedly votes this player into government positions is inherently advocating for his behavior.

I move for the proscription of the hostile region known as The South Pacific.

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Wouldn't a detente with Balder potentially threaten our already ice-y relations with Osiris? I know we both have a common rival - TBH - so establishing relations with them with this reason in mind would be somewhat easier than nothing; however, considering Balder's notable history of choosing their frivals (friends + rivals) wisely, I must make a point that this could threaten our eyes in the raider-sphere.

Osiris and TBH are rivals?

Glen-Rhodes - A security official, and the Chair of the Assembly in The South Pacific - is actively advocating a coup against Osiris. This is not the first time he and other TSP officials have engaged in hostile rhetoric, and a region that repeatedly votes this player into government positions is inherently advocating for his behavior.

Yeah that's not good. I also dislike the current regime in Osiris because it's both autocratic and raider, but advocating a coup is... an entirely new level

Local Councilroar.

Selfie

(This post was last modified: 03-26-2021, 02:23 PM by Apatosaurus.)

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Wouldn't a detente with Balder potentially threaten our already ice-y relations with Osiris? I know we both have a common rival - TBH - so establishing relations with them with this reason in mind would be somewhat easier than nothing; however, considering Balder's notable history of choosing their frivals (friends + rivals) wisely, I must make a point that this could threaten our eyes in the raider-sphere.

Osiris and TBH are rivals?

I believe Rabbitz is saying that Balder and TBH are rivals.

I have been things

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