Yes, I said that!

After some talk in the #legislators-lounge on Discord, I found out something...weird. Well, a lot of stuff we found, but I'm talking about the Great Council. The Great Council does...nothing. Why have a Great Council convene if you can just alter the laws of the Charter through the Assembly? Seems a bit...useless to me. 

The Great Council is...silly! Why have a special council potentially do something once per year, when we can always do it in a different body?

So again, why have this special Council when you can do everything through the Assembly? Comments encouraged.

Oh- and to clarify. This would give room for the current GC to end, and after that, we're done.

 

XIV. GREAT COUNCILS

Setting a procedure for constitutional conventions.

(1) When the Assembly wishes to debate the fundamental principles and structures of the Coalition, it may call a Great Council to rewrite all laws in their entirety, or establish a new state for the South Pacific.
(2) A resolution establishing a Great Council may be adopted with a three-fifths supermajority of the Assembly, which must be confirmed by a majority vote of the gameside community.
(3) The purpose of a Great Council is to rewrite all laws from the ground up, not merely to amend existing ones. The Assembly should use the normal amendment process for basic amendments, reserving Great Councils for a time when extreme changes are necessary and proper.
(4) Any and all changes to regional law proposed by a Great Council may be adopted by a three-fifths supermajority of the Assembly, which must be confirmed by a majority vote of the game-side community.
(5) If a Great Council fails to pass a new constitution and set of laws to replace the existing ones, then the existing laws will remain in place.
(6) At least one year must have passed since the previous Great Council before a new one may be established.

maluhia
minister of culture
ambassador to lazarus
roleplayer
 

 

(This post was last modified: 08-30-2022, 12:08 PM by maluhia.)

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Why have a Great Council convene every year if you can just alter the laws of the Charter through the Assembly?

You are misreading the law. There is no requirement that a Great Council should be held every year, the requirement is that a Great Council can't be held more than once a year. Those are two very different things.

Former Delegate of the South Pacific
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Reply

What are you talking about? I thought you were talking about moving to end the current Great Council, not abolish them altogether.

ProfessorHenn
Legislator

Reply

What are you talking about? I thought you were talking about moving to end the current Great Council, not abolish them altogether.

Well, I'm talking about abolishing the Great Council. As listed in the OP, it makes no sense to have one when you can do the regular affairs the Great Council can do through the Assembly, at any point in time, while the Great Council is for one specific point in time. I would like to see the Council ended promptly too.

maluhia
minister of culture
ambassador to lazarus
roleplayer
 

 

Reply

What are you talking about? I thought you were talking about moving to end the current Great Council, not abolish them altogether.

Well, I'm talking about abolishing the Great Council. As listed in the OP, it makes no sense to have one when you can do the regular affairs the Great Council can do through the Assembly, at any point in time, while the Great Council is for one specific point in time. I would like to see the Council ended promptly too.

maluhia
minister of culture
ambassador to lazarus
roleplayer
 

 

Reply

Why have a Great Council convene every year if you can just alter the laws of the Charter through the Assembly?

You are misreading the law. There is no requirement that a Great Council should be held every year, the requirement is that a Great Council can't be held more than once a year. Those are two very different things.

OP has been altered.

maluhia
minister of culture
ambassador to lazarus
roleplayer
 

 

Reply

What are you talking about? I thought you were talking about moving to end the current Great Council, not abolish them altogether.

Well, I'm talking about abolishing the Great Council. As listed in the OP, it makes no sense to have one when you can do the regular affairs the Great Council can do through the Assembly, at any point in time, while the Great Council is for one specific point in time. I would like to see the Council ended promptly too.

To end the Great Council, you'd have to move to end general debate.

5e. A motion to end general debate may be called no sooner than four weeks after of the convening of the Great Council. Upon recognition of the motion by the Chair or Deputy Chair, the motion shall be brought to vote for five days and adopted in favor by three-fifths of the Great Council. No new proposals may be submitted once the motion is recognized, unless and until the motion shall be rejected by the Great Council. One day following adoption, all outstanding proposals will be brought to vote for five days, unless retracted by the original proposer prior to voting starting, and adopted according to Article XIV, Section 5.
f. Should adopted proposals contain conflicting or contrary language, the Great Council will enter into a reconciliation period, wherein all conflicts will be resolved. Each conflicting proposal will be brought to a competing vote for five days, and the proposal favored by the greater number of participants will be adopted.
g. Following a reconciliation period, or in the absence of the need for one, the Chair of the Great Council shall combine all amendments into an omnibus and bring the omnibus to a final vote for five days. The final omnibus shall be adopted according to Article XIV, Section 5.
h. The Chair of the Great Council shall publish the final product of the Great Council, and recognize a motion by a participant to adjourn sine die. The motion to adjourn sine die shall be adopted by majority vote, and the final product shall be presented to the Chair of the Assembly for recording.

ProfessorHenn
Legislator

Reply

What are you talking about? I thought you were talking about moving to end the current Great Council, not abolish them altogether.

Well, I'm talking about abolishing the Great Council. As listed in the OP, it makes no sense to have one when you can do the regular affairs the Great Council can do through the Assembly, at any point in time, while the Great Council is for one specific point in time. I would like to see the Council ended promptly too.

To end the Great Council, you'd have to move to end general debate.

5e. A motion to end general debate may be called no sooner than four weeks after of the convening of the Great Council. Upon recognition of the motion by the Chair or Deputy Chair, the motion shall be brought to vote for five days and adopted in favor by three-fifths of the Great Council. No new proposals may be submitted once the motion is recognized, unless and until the motion shall be rejected by the Great Council. One day following adoption, all outstanding proposals will be brought to vote for five days, unless retracted by the original proposer prior to voting starting, and adopted according to Article XIV, Section 5.
f. Should adopted proposals contain conflicting or contrary language, the Great Council will enter into a reconciliation period, wherein all conflicts will be resolved. Each conflicting proposal will be brought to a competing vote for five days, and the proposal favored by the greater number of participants will be adopted.
g. Following a reconciliation period, or in the absence of the need for one, the Chair of the Great Council shall combine all amendments into an omnibus and bring the omnibus to a final vote for five days. The final omnibus shall be adopted according to Article XIV, Section 5.
h. The Chair of the Great Council shall publish the final product of the Great Council, and recognize a motion by a participant to adjourn sine die. The motion to adjourn sine die shall be adopted by majority vote, and the final product shall be presented to the Chair of the Assembly for recording.

I think we are misunderstanding each other! I am saying abolish the Great Council in future years, so that would mean getting rid of the gameside poll and Assembly vote on convening the council.

maluhia
minister of culture
ambassador to lazarus
roleplayer
 

 

Reply

We already voted to hold a Great Council (requiring a three-fifths majority vote in the Assembly) in spite of the objections you already cited. It would be silly to abolish it now for those reasons, especially given new proposals we have seen.

Spoiler

Republic of Lansoon (Pacifica)

Reply

We already voted to hold a Great Council (requiring a three-fifths majority vote in the Assembly) in spite of the objections you already cited. It would be silly to abolish it now for those reasons, especially given new proposals we have seen.

If this bill is passed, it would ensure that this Great Council would be able to finish, and after concluding, the Council shall be "archived" until relived by an Legislator who desires for it to return.

maluhia
minister of culture
ambassador to lazarus
roleplayer
 

 

Reply