Recall definitely applies to non-elected officials.

I think an argument could be made that recall shouldn't apply to officials who weren’t confirmed by the Assembly or elected to office, but my own preference would be to retain the broadest possible definition. I can think of a variety of circumstances where the Assembly might wish to recall a Deputy Minister or Deputy Chair, a Cabinet Advisor or even an individual member of a ministry.

I think there's arguments to be made either way, but it's complicated by the way we handle those positions legally.

In most of those cases the powers and even roles themselves are granted somewhat arbitrarily and independently of the law, so there's some doubt to raise about what you're actually removing from them from a legal standpoint. One could remove someone's Cabinet deputy status and have them left in a different position with almost the same responsibilities.

Which leads into the other problem, that as these positions are all at-will, by attempting to recall a deputy what you're really attempting to do is compel the uncooperative senior official to remove someone from their staff. And if it gets that far without the senior official doing anything, the recall should really probably be more directed at them at that point.

I'm ambivalent on whether they should be able to be recalled, I just think it gets into some murky legal territory about how we handle ministry staff.

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Recall definitely applies to non-elected officials.

I think an argument could be made that recall shouldn't apply to officials who weren’t confirmed by the Assembly or elected to office, but my own preference would be to retain the broadest possible definition. I can think of a variety of circumstances where the Assembly might wish to recall a Deputy Minister or Deputy Chair, a Cabinet Advisor or even an individual member of a ministry.

I think there's arguments to be made either way, but it's complicated by the way we handle those positions legally.

In most of those cases the powers and even roles themselves are granted somewhat arbitrarily and independently of the law, so there's some doubt to raise about what you're actually removing from them from a legal standpoint. One could remove someone's Cabinet deputy status and have them left in a different position with almost the same responsibilities.

Which leads into the other problem, that as these positions are all at-will, by attempting to recall a deputy what you're really attempting to do is compel the uncooperative senior official to remove someone from their staff. And if it gets that far without the senior official doing anything, the recall should really probably be more directed at them at that point.

I'm ambivalent on whether they should be able to be recalled, I just think it gets into some murky legal territory about how we handle ministry staff.

Really I don't think it's worth it to figure out the legal language of how to handle recall of ministry officials, so I'm going to say that the language should be applied to just elected or assembly confirmed officials.

Just to confirm, the list I have so far is:

1. Delegate
   
2. Prime Minister
   
3. Cabinet Ministers
   
4. Chair of Assembly
   
5. Chief/Associate Justices
   
6. Council on Regional Security
   
7. Legislator Committee
   
8. General Corps
   

(This post was last modified: 11-29-2020, 06:11 AM by Jebediah.)

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Local Councilors are not in any way, shape, or form elected or confirmed by the Assembly. LC is COMPLETELY gameside. And its been argued - ad nauseam - that it should stay that way.

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Local Councilors are not in any way, shape, or form elected or confirmed by the Assembly. LC is COMPLETELY gameside. And its been argued - ad nauseam - that it should stay that way.

I was copying as many elected positions as I could find and I forgot about that. I've edited the list.

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Historically, we have been able to recall anybody in government.

That applies to deputies, as well. I think there’s confusion there because recent Cabinets have done an end-run around deputies and just called everybody an advisor. But historically, and the ways our laws are set up, deputies are an official regulated position.

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Historically, we have been able to recall anybody in government.

That applies to deputies, as well. I think there’s confusion there because recent Cabinets have done an end-run around deputies and just called everybody an advisor. But historically, and the ways our laws are set up, deputies are an official regulated position.

I'm definitely in agreement overall, my personal concerns are more a procedural matter about the ad hoc nature of the ministry administration. But the topic of how we handle deputies from a legal standpoint is its own matter.

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Sorta bumping

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