(08-07-2020, 04:33 PM)Rabbitz Wrote: (08-07-2020, 03:55 PM)Royaltica Wrote: I agree with Whole India, we could have them under MoRA, but have separate ministers, kind of like SoS in MoFA. Or it could be split into Culture, Graphics, and Education.
"Ministers" implies that they have the same rank as the MoMA or MoFA. If this is what you mean, it means the dissolution of MoRA, and subjugating it under various different ministries. Plus, if you what you mean is "Deputies," it was already done under Jay's administration.
Some additions, the deputies were not elected nor did their choosing a public thing from what the above people have said which I assume are true. My idea is just for the executive branch to do the split themselves this time to "prove it" before we get a legislative split but actually open those positions for applications and such so deputies can have their own policies. The minister will still coordinate them when needed. But they will have their own goals to work for
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(This post was last modified: 08-08-2020, 12:06 AM by USoVietnam.)
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(08-08-2020, 12:04 AM)USoVietnam Wrote: (08-07-2020, 04:33 PM)Rabbitz Wrote: (08-07-2020, 03:55 PM)Royaltica Wrote: I agree with Whole India, we could have them under MoRA, but have separate ministers, kind of like SoS in MoFA. Or it could be split into Culture, Graphics, and Education.
"Ministers" implies that they have the same rank as the MoMA or MoFA. If this is what you mean, it means the dissolution of MoRA, and subjugating it under various different ministries. Plus, if you what you mean is "Deputies," it was already done under Jay's administration.
Some additions, the deputies were not elected nor did their choosing a public thing from what the above people have said which I assume are true. My idea is just for the executive branch to do the split themselves this time to "prove it" before we get a legislative split but actually open those positions for applications and such so deputies can have their own policies. The minister will still coordinate them when needed. But they will have their own goals to work for I won't agree for a direct Split, but I feel we can go for a Election of Deputies within the ministry's boundaries.i
(08-08-2020, 05:03 AM)Whole India Wrote: (08-08-2020, 12:04 AM)USoVietnam Wrote: (08-07-2020, 04:33 PM)Rabbitz Wrote: (08-07-2020, 03:55 PM)Royaltica Wrote: I agree with Whole India, we could have them under MoRA, but have separate ministers, kind of like SoS in MoFA. Or it could be split into Culture, Graphics, and Education.
"Ministers" implies that they have the same rank as the MoMA or MoFA. If this is what you mean, it means the dissolution of MoRA, and subjugating it under various different ministries. Plus, if you what you mean is "Deputies," it was already done under Jay's administration.
Some additions, the deputies were not elected nor did their choosing a public thing from what the above people have said which I assume are true. My idea is just for the executive branch to do the split themselves this time to "prove it" before we get a legislative split but actually open those positions for applications and such so deputies can have their own policies. The minister will still coordinate them when needed. But they will have their own goals to work for I won't agree for a direct Split, but I feel we can go for a Election of Deputies within the ministry's boundaries.i
This doesn't relieve pressure and maximize efficiency, it just adds another layer of bureaucracy to the MoRA, which would be severely counter-productive.
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So if what I just read is correct some of you want the MoRA to act like the PM of the department and have other elected "ministers/deputies of things" under them?
Is that what this is? I am so confused.
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(08-08-2020, 11:43 AM)Penguin Wrote: So if what I just read is correct some of you want the MoRA to act like the PM of the department and have other elected "ministers/deputies of things" under them?
Is that what this is? I am so confused.
That seems to be Whole India’s intention. Imo, impractical. Traditional applications may work better.
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(This post was last modified: 08-09-2020, 09:05 AM by USoVietnam.)
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This whole "Deputy" system, quite frankly, seems too complex, extremely impractical, and too much work.
You would essentially have three mini MoRAs and one overarching big MoRA. If the "Deputies" were allowed to have their own policies over their selected department, wouldn't that make them at the level of a Minister? If we followed this system, we would have to discuss how they would be chosen etc. etc.
The whole reason why the "Deputy" system works in MoFA is because one Minister can't possibly account for 20 regions at once without help.
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I mean cabinet ministers and split MoRA, Rabbitz.
(This post was last modified: 08-20-2020, 12:46 PM by Royaltica.)
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Maybe we could do a system where we split the MoRA into two - Ministries of Culture and Integration. Both Ministers are non-voting in the Cabinet, but they get to select a MoRA that votes for them.
Or we could just do a straight-up split. That works too.
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(This post was last modified: 08-20-2020, 01:22 PM by North Prarie.)
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(08-20-2020, 01:22 PM)North Prarie Wrote: Maybe we could do a system where we split the MoRA into two - Ministries of Culture and Integration. Both Ministers are non-voting in the Cabinet, but they get to select a MoRA that votes for them.
Or we could just do a straight-up split. That works too.
I've created the amendments for what this would look like -
The Charter of the Coalition Wrote:THE CHARTER OF THE SOUTH PACIFIC
...
VI. THE EXECUTIVE
Establishing an executive branch consisting of the Prime Minister and the Cabinet.
(1) The Prime Minister will be the head of government and the leader of the Cabinet. They will be responsible for the overall coordination of executive activities, being a liaison between the government and the community, and protecting the Coalition.
(2) The Cabinet will consist of ministers with the following portfolios: Foreign Affairs, Regional Affairs, and Military Affairs, Integration, and Culture.
(3) As leader of the Cabinet, the Prime Minister is responsible for overseeing a collective Cabinet agenda, and may give directions and instructions to the ministers. Disputes within the Cabinet are subject to the majority decision and collective responsibility; where there is no majority the Prime Minister’s vote shall be the deciding one.
(4) Members of the Executive are required to hold Legislator status.
Elections
(5) Executive elections will be held every four months, where the Prime Minister and all Cabinet positions will be up for election, excluding the Representative for Regional Affairs.
(6) The date, time, and manner of elections will be set by the Assembly in a law.
Minister of Regional Affairs
(7) The Minister of Regional Affairs will be responsible for promoting regional and forum activity, integrating new players into the forums, organizing cultural events, and communicating with the world about the South Pacific’s activities.Minister of Foreign Affairs(8) (7)The Minister of Foreign Affairs will be the Coalition’s chief diplomat. They will be responsible for establishing the government’s foreign policy program, communicating with allies, and coordinating with the military on foreign policy priorities when necessary.
(9) (8)The Minister of Foreign Affairs holds the sole power to initiate treaty negotiations with other regions, groups, and organizations, but may designate officers to handle those negotiations. Upon completion of a treaty negotiation, the Minister must present it to the full executive for majority approval, before submitting it to the Assembly for ratification.
(10)(9)The Minister of Foreign Affairs will be responsible for establishing standards for the creation and maintenance of consulates and embassies.
Minister of Military Affairs(11)(10)The Minister of Military Affairs will be the civilian leader of the armed forces of the Coalition, the South Pacific Special Forces. In conjunction with a group of Generals, the Minister of Military Affairs will be responsible for the defense of the Coalition, building military activity, and conducting military operations.
(12)(11)The Minister of Military Affairs may elect to establish an intelligence office, in equal coordination with the Council on Regional Security.
Minister of Integration
(12) The Minister of Integration will be responsible for integrating players into the region, promoting forum, gameside, and off-site activity, and maintaining regional indexes, guides, and announcements.
(13) The Minister of Integration shall be a non-voting member of the Cabinet.
Minister of Culture
(14) The Minister of Culture will be responsible for running Coaliton-sponsored media, administering games, events, and festivals, and communicating to the world news about the South Pacific's activities.(15) The Minister of Culture shall be a non-voting member of the Cabinet.The Representative for Regional Affairs
(16) The Ministers of Integration and Culture shall select a Representative for Regional Affairs, who shall be a voting Cabinet member.Executive Authorities(13)(17) The executive may exercise the collective authority of executive orders, by unanimous consent among the Prime Minister and Cabinet Ministers. Executive orders may only be issued to address an immediate and pressing issue created by ambiguity or holes in a particular law, which will immediately have the effect of law.
(14) (18) Upon declaring an executive order, the order will be presented automatically to the Assembly for three days of debate, followed by a vote according to legislative rules, where it will expire and its effects shall be reversed if the Assembly does not incorporate it into law.
(15)(19) The Prime Minister and Cabinet Ministers may elect to appoint deputies and advisors, who will be considered junior members of the Cabinet, but will not have voting rights in any executive decision.
The Charter of the Coalition Wrote:THE CHARTER OF THE SOUTH PACIFIC
...
VI. THE EXECUTIVE
Establishing an executive branch consisting of the Prime Minister and the Cabinet.
(1) The Prime Minister will be the head of government and the leader of the Cabinet. They will be responsible for the overall coordination of executive activities, being a liaison between the government and the community, and protecting the Coalition.
(2) The Cabinet will consist of ministers with the following portfolios: Foreign Affairs, Regional Affairs, and Military Affairs, Integration, and Culture.
(3) As leader of the Cabinet, the Prime Minister is responsible for overseeing a collective Cabinet agenda, and may give directions and instructions to the ministers. Disputes within the Cabinet are subject to the majority decision and collective responsibility; where there is no majority the Prime Minister’s vote shall be the deciding one.
(4) Members of the Executive are required to hold Legislator status.
Elections
(5) Executive elections will be held every four months, where the Prime Minister and all Cabinet positions will be up for election.
(6) The date, time, and manner of elections will be set by the Assembly in a law.
Minister of Regional Affairs
(7) The Minister of Regional Affairs will be responsible for promoting regional and forum activity, integrating new players into the forums, organizing cultural events, and communicating with the world about the South Pacific’s activities.Minister of Foreign Affairs(8) (7)The Minister of Foreign Affairs will be the Coalition’s chief diplomat. They will be responsible for establishing the government’s foreign policy program, communicating with allies, and coordinating with the military on foreign policy priorities when necessary.
(9) (8)The Minister of Foreign Affairs holds the sole power to initiate treaty negotiations with other regions, groups, and organizations, but may designate officers to handle those negotiations. Upon completion of a treaty negotiation, the Minister must present it to the full executive for majority approval, before submitting it to the Assembly for ratification.
(10)(9)The Minister of Foreign Affairs will be responsible for establishing standards for the creation and maintenance of consulates and embassies.
Minister of Military Affairs(11)(10)The Minister of Military Affairs will be the civilian leader of the armed forces of the Coalition, the South Pacific Special Forces. In conjunction with a group of Generals, the Minister of Military Affairs will be responsible for the defense of the Coalition, building military activity, and conducting military operations.
(12)(11)The Minister of Military Affairs may elect to establish an intelligence office, in equal coordination with the Council on Regional Security.
Minister of Integration
(12) The Minister of Integration will be responsible for integrating players into the region, promoting forum, gameside, and off-site activity, and maintaining regional indexes, guides, and announcements.
Minister of Culture
(13) The Minister of Culture will be responsible for running Coaliton-sponsored media, administering games, events, and festivals, and communicating to the world news about the South Pacific's activities.Executive Authorities(13)(14) The executive may exercise the collective authority of executive orders, by unanimous consent among the Prime Minister and Cabinet Ministers. Executive orders may only be issued to address an immediate and pressing issue created by ambiguity or holes in a particular law, which will immediately have the effect of law.
(14) (15) Upon declaring an executive order, the order will be presented automatically to the Assembly for three days of debate, followed by a vote according to legislative rules, where it will expire and its effects shall be reversed if the Assembly does not incorporate it into law.
(15)(16) The Prime Minister and Cabinet Ministers may elect to appoint deputies and advisors, who will be considered junior members of the Cabinet, but will not have voting rights in any executive decision.
Plus the necessary additions to the Elections Act, ofc.
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So, for a split.
If we split it let's not do like a half split as proposed above. That is unneccessary bureocracy we don't need.
I could be in favor of an events+media and integration split as was proposed before, if we decide to split. And I can see a strong argument in reducing ministry portfolio to groups that are sensible, and increasing region-focused representation in the cabinet.
But the kind of "half-split" proposed above really just seems unneccesary.
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