Xoriet, literally everybody here has said it would apply to current members. We've even listed who the current members are. So I don't see what point you have there. You are the only person so far who has brought up Nai, Todd, Earth, etc in any capacity.

(04-14-2015, 09:24 AM)Hileville Wrote: Especially considering several members of the Empire aided us during Milo's coup.

I am going to confirm this statement. Biyah is the one I recall, since I had interacted with him during those times.

(04-13-2015, 11:08 PM)Unibot Wrote: A prohibited group only applies to current members. Current known members include Dali, Neenee, NK, and Biyah. Wolf isn't a current member according to him.

(04-14-2015, 11:50 PM)Xoriet Wrote: I'm not all that bothered about Dali and Nee. I'm disturbed by the rampant and over-dramatic concept of "guilt by association."

(04-15-2015, 01:16 AM)Xoriet Wrote:

(04-14-2015, 11:57 PM)Unibot Wrote: I'm concerned that Xoriet thinks we should just ignore Dali and Neenee's extensive history of being troublemakers and security threats, because TEP is friends with them and they haven't couped there yet. *rolls his eyes*

Friendly =/= Trustworthy

That is not what I said, dearest Unibot. Dali and Nee are not peripheral Empire, they are The Empire. Did you miss the part where I emphasized my concern? While I find the idea that they might coup TSP to be unlikely, the likelihood of anyone associated being a danger to all of you is the absurdity.

Blue Wolf, Yy4u, Westwind, Earth22, Kandarin, Todd McCloud, Naivetry, etc. Definitely out to get you all, like boogeymen. Right?

It would be beneficial if, instead of jumping to conclusions or expecting the worst from someone to actually read their very clear and direct statements. 

It prevents it from seeming like "all of you" or the people who created this thread and\or are discussing important security issues (which are all the more critical because, as the recent coup in Lazarus shows, no region is 100% safe even if it thinks it is) are actually the opposite of absurd.

Condescension towards a region and its security concerns is a highly unattractive quality in itself. For those who were here during the Milograd coup of 2013, this may be a game but its a game in which people place significant emotional investment and build communities. Therefore, the risk of someone coming in and destroying that community that is built with time, effort, and engagement is a serious one.

It's a strange situation when the people accusing other people of certain qualities exhibit them.

Moving on from that bit of unnecessary absurdity:

It would be helpful to know in what tangible ways Empire helped TSP during the coup as its something most people don't know about and that would be critical in understanding the relationship between Empire and TSP and how we should move forward.

Obviously, NK has recently been part of the coup in Lazarus but it seems like he is using NPO to support that rather then membership in Empire?

And I have stated this before, unless there is a reason a group or region doesn't want it to be known that they helped us during the coup, it would be really nice to have a list of regions\groups\players who are reliable and have helped in the past.  This helps players, new and old, to understand the network of connections in the region.

"The Empire" didn't help during Milograd's coup. Biyah and Dali were involved in the "Southern Allied Command." Meanwhile, in 2013, a State of Emergency was declared over the most minor suspicions of Escade actually being Neenee.

Somewhere along the line in these past few weeks and months, the leadership of this region went from knowing what kind threat The Empire is, to not having any kind of coherent thought about it at all. What Belschaft did to Escade was inappropriate, don't get me wrong. But it shows just how much of a threat The Empire (particularly Neenee) has been considered to be over the years.

I never knew why the State of Emergency was declared other then that a random puppet TGed some nonsense that sounded like something out of a kids book (X marks the Spot of Where the Y etc nonsense). Is there some sort of report or where would I find that information?

(04-15-2015, 12:40 PM)Escade Wrote: I never knew why the State of Emergency was declared other then that a random puppet TGed some nonsense that sounded like something out of a kids book (X marks the Spot of Where the Y etc nonsense).  Is there some sort of report or where would I find that information?

Not a CSS report, but it was reported in NS Gameplay: http://forum.nationstates.net/viewtopic....#p18073884

(04-15-2015, 12:33 PM)Sandaoguo Wrote: "The Empire" didn't help during Milograd's coup. Biyah and Dali were involved in the "Southern Allied Command." Meanwhile, in 2013, a State of Emergency was declared over the most minor suspicions of Escade actually being Neenee.

Somewhere along the line in these past few weeks and months, the leadership of this region went from knowing what kind threat The Empire is, to not having any kind of coherent thought about it at all. What Belschaft did to Escade was inappropriate, don't get me wrong. But it shows just how much of a threat The Empire (particularly Neenee) has been considered to be over the years.

To clarify, would you suggest separating Biyah and Dali (maybe putting them in observation) from Neenee and the rest of The Empire? And maybe setting up a deeper investigation about the risk she may have implied to the point of being a feasible excuse for Belschaft to do what he did to Escade?

The State of Emergency was declared because Escade (and later Belschaft) received a telegram accusing her of being Neenee. An IP check then resulted in some inconsistencies, which is why Belschaft called for a CSS vote on the SoE. That was all explained extensively during and after the event.

--

Bono, it wasn't a just a feasible excuse. While declaring a full blown State of Emergency was most definitely not the answer, it does prove the extent to which Neenee (and overall The Empire) was viewed as a threat to the region.

(04-15-2015, 12:08 PM)Escade Wrote: It would be helpful to know in what tangible ways Empire helped TSP during the coup as its something most people don't know about and that would be critical in understanding the relationship between Empire and TSP and how we should move forward.

"The Empire" as a group did not help TSP, but some of its "members" did, just as The West Pacific as a region did not help TSP, yet some of its members like Punk Daddy did. But from I can remember, Biyah helped in the Southern Allied Command, particularly in communications issues and publicity/counter-propaganda. IIRC they were there because Osiris was our ally and they're part of Osiris. I'm not sure about the others as I don't know which archive to dig atm.

I'd rather treat them individually instead of as a group.

Kris, I think what Bon is stating is that if the risk of me being Neenee was great enough for the CSS to declare a state of emergency then what reasoning was behind that? What about Neenee specifically caused them to take such a drastic action?

I know about the telegram itself and shared it with you because it was written by an obvious puppet and written like a Scooby Doo mystery threat. You were the head of CSS at the time, I believe, and also took it as one of the strange TGs that delegates get until Belschaft got involved.

I'm still unclear about what about Neenee at the time, especially if she were to be legally elected as a delegate in TSP, caused a state of emergency to be declared. What about her raised the alarm?

Brutland & Norden, I actually agree which I state elsewhere that the prohibited groups usage can have repercussions and consequences that aren't entirely clear which is why it should be used with care.