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Omega · 08-13-2016, 06:00 PM

(08-13-2016, 05:02 PM)Belschaft Wrote: The problem with that is Tsu, when you look at the previous regional poll - where the TG I sent out provided information - I ended up in court because some people didn't like the information I provided.

Honest to god, whilst I like your intentions with this I can't see it achieving anything but resulting in the Local Council Assembly Representative being brought to court once a month.

Bel you used the phrase "I feel" in that telegram. A phrase wich is literally showing your bias.

Above all else, I hope to be a decent person.
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***sandaoguo*** · 08-13-2016, 06:08 PM

The fact that we're parsing what counts as an opinion or advancing an agenda is ridiculous. We all know what it means.

Don't use mass TGs for anything other than a notification that something is happening. You don't see Assembly vote threads including any opinions. It's not a difficult thing to understand!

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(This post was last modified: 08-13-2016, 06:10 PM by sandaoguo.)

***Roavin*** · 08-13-2016, 06:21 PM

sighs

Bel, you were not taken to court. A general LQ was filed. That LQ was not filed because you provided information. Almost everybody agrees that the LC representative should give the region information (despite your best efforts to illegitimately claim otherwise). The LQ was filed because you provided an explicit recommendation on how the region should vote. No court case came of it, because none was warranted.

Considering the history of the broader issue with you over the past months, I'm just going to flat-out say that you're actively lying/deceiving to score political cheap-shots.

***Roavin*** · 08-13-2016, 07:47 PM

Now, on to the issue at hand Smile

I'm fond of Tsu's draft, though there are a few changes and additions I feel are necessary:

As part of this, we should include unified approval of mass-TGs. This is something Bel and I have discussed briefly on Discord, and I also know others feel this is a good idea. I suggest removing the language restricting the LC from the charter, and including in this act the appropriate rules which then applies to everybody (LC, MoRA, etc.)
The term 'limited' is very ambiguous here, and to be honest I'm not quite sure what Tsu meant by it. I assume it's supposed to mean that the region isn't spammed with mass-TGs. I changed it accordingly.
Removed the term 'trustworthy', as it's a subjective feeling of individuals that can't be legislated.
I changed article two to be a bit more inclusive so that it basically covers anybody who could mass-communicate, and moved it to article 1.
In preparation for further NS changes, added a clause for other forms of mass communication not explicitly listed to be covered.
I removed "attempt to lower endorsements of elected officials" and replaced it with something more general. The intent, I presume, was to explicitly state that nothing should be done to threaten the security of the region. However, there are other things that could be done (such as encouraging endorsements for a would-be couper), and a call to lower endorsements for an official may be justified in certain instances (Delegate transitions, for example).
Removed what could happen to somebody accused of an infraction, as it's up to the courts to decide. Instead, I added that the Delegate may suspend the powers for the duration of the court proceedings.
Finally, just various formatting and wording changes. I made sure to use "shall" to mean something that must be done and "may" to mean something that could be done.

Sorry that it looks like I took a chainsaw to it, Tsu :>

Regional Communications Act

An act clarifying proper communication by government officials

1. ScopeCommunications Covered by this Act

(1) Modes of mass communication covered include
a. Mass Telegrams to the region
b. Pinned Dispatches pinned to the regional World Factbook Entry
c. Changes to the regional World Factbook Entry
d. Any other form of communication visible by the in-game region at large separate from the Regional Message Board.

(2) Any individual capable of engaging in mass communication with the region as described above shall be subject to the regulations contained herein.

2. Government Officials

(1) All elected or appointed regional officials are covered by this act, whether they are using powers provided in the "Regional Officers Act" or received independently.

3. Appropriateness of Communication 2. Mass Communication

(1) Communications to the region should shall be
a. respectful
b. honest
c. trustworthy
d. limited
c. restrained to a reasonable frequency of notifications

(2) Communications to the region should shall not

a. mislead the public
b. push particular legislative agendas
c. attack or otherwise diminish other officials
d. attack or otherwise diminish The South Pacific or her allies
e. attempt to lower endorsements of elected officials
e. directly or indirectly threaten the security apparatus of the South Pacific or her allies

(3) The Delegate may, at their discretion, enact further restrictions, guidelines, or approval processes on the use mass communications.

(4) The Council on Regional Security may temporarily suspend the provisions contained herein for themselves or any duly chosen surrogates for purposes of regional security.

43. Infractions

(1) Charges regarding infractions to this act Infractions may be brought before the Permanent Justice in a court case. For the duration of the court proceedings, the Delegate may suspend the mass communication capabilities of the accused.

(2) Officials who are found to have violated this act may be subjected to
a. suspension or removal of regional officer privileges
b. suspension or removal from office

5. Suspension

(1) This act may be suspended with the consent of the Council for Regional Security.

As for the Charter amendment, Article V:

3. The Local Council will have the authority to run regional polls, create and pin Dispatches, and to suppress messages on the Regional Message Board according to a standard moderation policy. It may not alter the regional flag or tags, and may not send out mass telegrams, without the approval of the Delegate.

(This post was last modified: 08-13-2016, 08:00 PM by Roavin.)

Omega · 08-14-2016, 12:25 AM

Alright 2 problems:
1. Sec. 1.1.d is WAY too broad as it could include any public discussion ANYWHERE!
2. Sec 2.2.b is still not addressed (and some people will not know what it means without the court telling us)

Above all else, I hope to be a decent person.
Has Been
What's Next?

CoA: August 2016-January 2017
Minister of Foreign Affairs: October 2019-June 2020, October 2020- February 2021

**Belschaft** · 08-14-2016, 10:33 AM

Roa, when a legal question asks whether or not criminal charges can be filed against me I think I'm within my rights to consider it me being taken to court.

_{Minister of Media, Subversion and Sandwich Making}
^{Associate Justice of the High Court and Senior Moderator}

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***Tsunamy*** · 08-14-2016, 10:34 AM

(08-13-2016, 05:02 PM)Belschaft Wrote: The problem with that is Tsu, when you look at the previous regional poll - where the TG I sent out provided information - I ended up in court because some people didn't like the information I provided.

Honest to god, whilst I like your intentions with this I can't see it achieving anything but resulting in the Local Council Assembly Representative being brought to court once a month.

The idea is to prevent court cases as such and to clearly establish what we can put into our mass communication.

I also have to agree with Roavin here, in that your weren't taken to court per se, but your actions spurred a Legal Question. Just as the Cabinet's dissolution of the Balder Treaty called for a LQ. That's not something again you "Bel should be punished for x, y and z" but rather asking where our legal limits are (no matter how Discord debates are framed).

Finally, as I've tried to stress, this isn't an issue about anyone or anything in particular. Rather, this is something that should be set up for future generations of SPers. We don't know what future leaders will do with the powers at hand and, again, it would be really easy for a delegate, a Prime Minister or a Local Councillor to start a wider war against other members of the government.

Right now, I don't think we have the mechanisms in place to stop this stuff without (a) being legally questionable and (b) prompting more court cases.

-tsunamy
[forum admin]

**Belschaft** · 08-14-2016, 10:46 AM

I'm not opposed to this per-se, I just think some of the language is dangerously open ended and far to open to interpretation.

I could also see merit in extending this to all forms of mass-communication - including using stamps or scripts to TG the entire region - not just RO powers.

_{Minister of Media, Subversion and Sandwich Making}
^{Associate Justice of the High Court and Senior Moderator}

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***Tsunamy*** · 08-14-2016, 02:18 PM

(08-14-2016, 10:46 AM)Belschaft Wrote: I'm not opposed to this per-se, I just think some of the language is dangerously open ended and far to open to interpretation.

I could also see merit in extending this to all forms of mass-communication - including using stamps or scripts to TG the entire region - not just RO powers.

Yep! That was my goal by 2(1) of my initial posting -- to make sure it wasn't just under RO stuff.

And, like I said, I'm happy to narrow the scope. Just wanted to start this discussion.

-tsunamy
[forum admin]

***Roavin*** · 08-14-2016, 03:44 PM

Some changes to my revised draft based on discussion here and on Discord.

Summary of changes:

Omega correctly pointed out that my wording for 1.1.d was too broad. I've restricted it accordingly.
Omega also pointed at 2.2.b ("push particular legislative agendas"). While I personally find the language okay as is, I see that this is not generally the case and after taking input from Bel, Tsu, Glen, and Seraph on Discord, I've removed it and instead added a positive formulation in 2.1.d.

What I did not change:

Bel mentioned that this should extend to "all forms of mass-communication - including using stamps or scripts to TG the entire region - not just RO powers". I believe my draft as written already does this as far as possible. We can't prevent using stamps to TG the entire region from outside except via GHR, and that is beyond TSP's jurisdiction (and would have to be solved via the Delegate filing a GHR).

I've marked red/blue here the changes based on my previous draft, not based on the original Tsu draft. Otherwise this would be impossible to read >_>

Regional Communications Act

An act clarifying proper communication by government officials

1. Scope

(1) Modes of mass communication covered include
a. Mass Telegrams to the region
b. Dispatches pinned to the regional World Factbook Entry
c. Changes to the regional World Factbook Entry
d. Any other form of communication visible by the in-game region at large separate from the Regional Message Board.
d. Any other form of communication, apart from the Regional Message Board, that is directly visible on the NationStates website by the in-game region at large.

(2) Any individual capable of engaging in mass communication with the region as described above shall be subject to the regulations contained herein.

2. Mass Communication

(1) Communications to the region shall be
a. respectful
b. honest
c. restrained to a reasonable frequency of notifications
d. neutral with respect to political ideology or debate

(2) Communications to the region shall not
a. mislead the public
b. push particular legislative agendas
cb. attack or otherwise diminish other officials
dc. attack or otherwise diminish The South Pacific or her allies
ed. directly or indirectly threaten the security apparatus of the South Pacific or her allies

(3) The Delegate may, at their discretion, enact further restrictions, guidelines, or approval processes on the use of mass communications.

(4) The Council on Regional Security may temporarily suspend the provisions contained herein for themselves or any duly chosen surrogates for purposes of regional security.

3. Infractions

(1) Infractions may be brought before the Permanent Justice in a court case. For the duration of the court proceedings, the Delegate may suspend the mass communication capabilities of the accused.

Charter amendment, Article V (stays as is):

3. The Local Council will have the authority to run regional polls, create and pin Dispatches, and to suppress messages on the Regional Message Board according to a standard moderation policy. It may not alter the regional flag or tags, and may not send out mass telegrams,without the approval of the Delegate.

(This post was last modified: 08-17-2016, 05:46 PM by Roavin. Edit Reason: Quick grammar fix - Thanks Seraph for pointing it out! )